Wind Turbines
Wednesday 18th April, Cornwall County Council planning committee narrowly refused our planning application for the 2x20kw turbines. 8 votes against to 7 votes in favour. A very finely balanced decision.
We still hope to generate our own sustainable energy on the farm in the future. Organic farming and farm holidays powered by the wind. We understand it’s a contentious issue, polarising opinions in the community. However, it’s one that believe is worth pursuing.
Debbie.
It’s no good just getting all your followers to put in letters of support for you turbines. It’s quality not quantity that counts with planning comment letters! All the ones posted so far are absolutely usless to your cause; they actualy have to give sound reasons, not just airy fairy stuff about sustainability , and what nice organic chaps you are etc. They have to look at the planning policy for the area and make a sensible and well argued case for permission BASED ON THE EXISTING PLANNING POLICY! In fact, what is being put up at the moment will do more harm than good – it just gives the impression that you have organised a one sided petition from your chums
Hi Allan, firstly, may I point out that the comments on the County Council website have been independently posted. I can discuss the planning application with my ‘chums’, and I may ask them to comment, but ultimately they will decide for themselves whether to support or object. In my opinion, the views posted are valid, and form part of an important discussion leading to a decision. It is afterall a PUBLIC consultation. Sue Reardon and David Jenkinson have land neighbouring ours. Jim Soufi has invited people to visit his 15m turbine at Tywardreath. Others refer to Government policy to progress towards renewable electricy generation. Comments of support imply that any visual impact of these very-small turbines (classified as such) will be outweighed by the benefits of the energy produced.
Thank you for your concerns regarding the harmful effects of positive comments, but I shan’t be losing any sleep.
Regards, Debbie Andrews
Yet another attemp to pull the wool over our eyes on wind turbines.. The planning applications contain many innacuracies though it is not for me to say whether thet are deliberately dishonest or not. I live neat the St Breock turbine, it is noisy and has a detrimental effect on the landscape. Why have you not put forward an environmental impact statement in support of your application? If you are so convinced that this is more than just a cash cow to your holiday business for disabled persons largely funded by the taxpayer then get the environmental assesment done.
Dear Peter, we don’t need to put forward an Environmental Impact Assessment (EIA), as according to the Secretary of State this ‘Very Small’ development will not impact on the environment. Details of the turbines at St Breock: Rated Power: 4.95MW; Wind Turbines: 11 x Bonus 450kW; Rotor Diameter: 36 metres; Hub Height: 35m. Ours would be a total 21.48m, compared to those at St Breok which are 53m to the blade tips. AND at St Breok there are 11 of them.
I hope you’ll agree that there is little comparison to be made here.
Not a ‘cash cow’ as you put it. Merely an effort to become self sufficient and reduce our dependency on carbon fuels. The fact that our fuel is mined elsewhere to the huge detriment to other ecosystems, habitats and populations (see articles regarding tar sands) does not mean that we shouldn’t take responsibility where we can.
Regards, Debbie Andrews.
Pulling the wool over our eyes ??
You state that the height will be 21.48 metres. Why then put up 15 metre masts to show the height to all of your villagers. Your demonstration mast is 6.48 metres or 20 ft short, dont take people for fools. That is pure deceit at its lowest form. But since as locals tell me that you got thrown off the parish council a few years back for a similar planning ” mistake” its not as if you dont have history !!!!
Oh dear … it is standard to erect a post to the height of the hub. No wool. I have said all along that the posts will give an idea of the HUB HEIGHT. I am being as open and as honest as I can be – I will be sitting in the Reading Rooms in Golant tomorrow from 11.30am until 1pm for anyone to come along and have a chat. I am extremely happy for anyone to come and visit the poles. This is meant for local parishoners. I have absolutely no problem with discussing the project.
AND for your information, I resigned from the Parish Council, NOT thrown off, and so it would appear that you have your facts wrong. Please check what you are saying before posting on a public site. Alternatively, put yourself up for election as Councillor to serve your Parish as I did.
Thanks.
Firstly, my initial comment was meant to help. Your defensive and agressive reply was, well…. odd.
Can we just be clear on a few things?
Is it not the case that, by lowering the footings of your turbines by 500mms, you have managed to have the turbines classified as ‘very small’? (Let us all remember that ‘very small’ is a relative category and not a description). So, you managed to avoid an Environmental impact assessment on a technicality? yes?
You have, in now deleted postings of your own, which indignantly protested about accusations that you had been making statements that were incorrect. Well here are just two examples for you to mull over: -
1. At the Parish council meeting that discussed your proposal, you stated that the turbines would not be visible beyond 2.5 Km. It was pointed out to you that the graphic you were using was showing the area within a 2.5 km radius where they would be seen, IT WAS NOT DEMONSTRATING THAT THEY WOULD NOT BE VISIBLE BEYOND 2.5 km. So, your assertion that they would not be seen beyond 2.5km was: not correct/untrue/a mistake/wrong…. take it as you will, but your statement was untrue.
(My brother recorded the whole meeting so I have absolute proof)
2. Your application stated that you had held a public consultation when you had not. FACT!!!!
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I farm in Cornwall myself, am third generation, and am happy to admit that I could not survive without subsidies, but it really galls is when we see ‘subsidy chasers’ who don’t do a lot of real farming (other than mucking out the visitors and feeding the guinea pigs), jumping on every bandwagon that floats by, and then, coming on all indignant when the locals, exercising their rights, object.
I am glad that you have taken down some of the contentious postings; you supporter who purported to be some kind of Rural Educator was especially out of order and, downright offensive. You may probably edit this out also but at least I have communicated to you.
Lets face it, we need a national policy!
Please support the Royal Cornwall Show!
I’ll have to be brief. I am busy. Farming. No guinea pigs today and no changeover! You don’t know us, and yet you make grand assumptions.
Firstly, no, we have NOT lowered the footings. We have plans to purchase a turbine that falls within the ‘very small’ classification. The turbines will obviously be made to maximise their potential within that category. Of course. The company who make them will realise that for the machines to be exempt from an EIA they must be below a particular height. Not deceitful, just pure common sense.
Secondly, we have been assured by our consultants that the turbines will not be seen beyond 2.5km. And the map that you refer to was showing where the turbines would be seen, diminishing in size to a point at which they would no longer be visible (at 2.5km). However you argue it, I can’t see what the difference is.
In answer to your third point, the statement of community involvement was not dishonest. It clearly made reference to the original application for a 50kw turbine as well as the second application. Both applications were considered relevant to the statement, as the first application, which included a public consultation, lead to the downsizing and the relocating of the subsequent two 20kw turbines in the second application. If you had bothered to read the statement you would realise that it referred to a public consultation that took place for the 50kw turbine. No lies.
We farm at South Torfrey. We are not subsidy chasers. We grow cereals to feed the 1000 turkeys and 200 geese for the Christmas market, all dressed by us on the farm. We have a small beef suckler herd. I’m not justifying myself to you, simply putting you straight. Tourism is an integral part of our business plan just like many other farmers in this county, be they 1st, 2nd, 3rd generation. The electricity that we will harvest from the wind will meet our requirements and not much more. We wish to provide green electricity for our business supporting our organic farming ethics. Obviously, with the prices of electricity sky rocketing, a scheme such as this will allow our business to be self sufficient in electricity and not reliant upon the pricing policies of giant multinational fuel companies. I do not see what is immoral in that. It means that we will be able to plan our business in the future, and continue with the holiday letting business and ultimately continue to farm the land.
I appreciate that wind turbines are not supported across the board. I respect other people’s points of view. I am not dishonest, certainly not aggressive. Tenacious, yes. But as determined about my beliefs as you are about yours and Barry Campbell-Taylor is about his.
I have removed Mr Campbell-Taylor’s comments from my blog, along with my replies and Mr Slack’s interjections. It was getting out of hand – insulting and rude. When Mr Campbell-Taylor came back with the ridiculous ‘those who can do, those who can’t teach …’ remark, I thought that enough was certainly enough. By all means create your own ‘Stop the Turbine’s’ Facebook page, and you can all let off steam as you wish. But not on my company blog. I’m fed up with being called a liar and a money grabbing farmer. Both my husband and I are primarily interested in habitat management and wildlife protection, and wish to erect these turbines for the most positive reasons – so that we can continue here looking after our plot as best as we can. Please remember. turbines are temporary structures. In 20 years from now some other small scale technology may well have taken their place.
Kind regards. Debbie Andrews
Perhaps if your husband worked for a living instead of meditatimg all day then you wouldnt need government subsidies to live on. Your business has already been founded on disabled grantd, now you chase more . Pitifull.
Dear Mr Leebing. Your comments have nothing to do with wind turbines it seems, but are a verbal attack on my family. Simon practices Christian meditation for an hour each day. I am surprised and saddened that this offends you. Our accessible accommodation, partly grant funded, has enabled plenty of physically disabled people plus families with autistic children to enjoy a comfortable stay on our farm. We believe we have a fantastic facility. With regard to subsidies, I think you’ll find that they are claimed by all farmers that are entitled to them – we are by no means unusual in this.
It shocks me to get such a personal email direct to my phone from a stranger who claims to know so much about us. I sincerely hope that you do not have children who may follow your example. It’s playground bullying. Please stop.
Hi I have just read the blogs. Let me tell you this is a working farm all hours if not with animals with human beings.
Debbie Simon and the family could not do enough for us on our holiday.
Everyone is entitled to a break even for an hour. I think that is the law. How we choose to spend this time is OUR choice.
To Debbie and Simon you are doing a fantastic job the best way you know. Supporting charities and Cornwall. You don’t have to answer to anyone but yourselves. Keep your heads held high.
Some people are not happy with their own lives and have to bring you down to their level.
Copied from text sent from Cosgrove family, 7/5/12. Thanks for your support.
Hey just read your blog. What disgusting and negative comments from rude uninformed bigots. You guys do nothing but good. Don’t give up on your cause Debbie & Simon. J&A x
Copied from mail sent by Wilson family 7/5/12. Thanks again.
Goodness me, what an utterly sad state of affairs for grown human beings to engage in…what, exactly, is the problem with Simon & Debbie generating their own electricity in the best way they can? Debbie is correct – this is akin to playground bullying. Voltaire said, and I paraphrase for any pedants reading, ‘I will defend to my death your right to disagree’. Please note the word ‘disagree’..not personal insults, slander or the like.
The Andrews are hard working people, committed to a sustainable mode of farming so the next generation has healthy land to inherit and farm. They may not be farmers in the ‘usual’ mode, farmers they be – whether you like it or not. They have always worked hard to create premium quality produce whilst having as small a negative impact on the land as possible. Now, they want to generate their own electricity…metaphorically an offense worthy of the stocks!
I only hope that those making the emotionally charged posts do not encourage their children to behave in such a manner. The world has enough numpties as it is.
Just read these postings for the first time and can’t believe what I’m reading from the likes of Mr Driscoll, Mr Jones and Mr Leebing. Personally I think you’re all the same person; at least I’m hoping you are, as I would hate to think that there are three people this arrogant and rude. It’s plain and obvious to all that read these comments that this has very little to do with wind turbines. Most of the postings aren’t even about the turbines, but are character assassinations. I think this comes down to some kind of silly jealousy, gripe, or most probably that Debbie and Simon are easy targets because they’re doing something different with their approach to farming and holidays. Wind turbines are easily erected and taken down; they do not harm the land. You are so against them and yet none of you will be able to see them directly. Out of interest, have you made similar complaints about unsightly solar paneling on roofs around your villages, or perhaps unsightly wheel chair ramps? It wouldn’t surprise me, you seem to have so little to do with your time.
To you Mr Driscoll, sustainably and renewable sources of power, organic farms and such are no “airy fairy matters”. They’re very valid and important issues in this day and age. Where have you been? I’m assuming that you’re the kind of guy who doesn’t care what type of fuel he burns or what chemicals are used on his land as long as the pollution doesn’t blow his way. It is Unfortunate that people like you have always been around, hiding behind your computer screen, making assumptions, saying nasty things to make progress hard for people that want to make a difference. You’re scared of innovation. It’s a shame people like you don’t put your efforts into more positive and worthwhile causes, or simply going about things in the correct manner.
A question to you Mr Leebing. What difference have you made to anything in the last 10 years other than acting like a problematic 16 year old, leaving nasty comments on a blogs and making life uneasy for people who just want to get on with THEIR own business? You better run along Mr Leebing, Jeremy Kyle’s on in 10 minutes.
Other postings on this Blog may be seen as a few futile words from chums and not weighty letters to someone in the Parish Council or addressed to a County Planner. However, what these postings represent Mr Driscoll is support for Debbie and Simon, and I for one will be supporting them all the way.
Hi.
Can I step in here and just remind everyone what this is all about: the Andrew’s would like to erect some turbines to produce electricity for their enterprise and perhaps a bit of surplus to sell to the national grid. Objectors feel that the turbines will despoil an area, designated at an Area of Outstanding Natural Beauty. The arguments for, and against are accessible on the Cornwall Council website and make interesting reading.
Now why did this become heated and personal? Well, the objectors felt that much of the information on the application was misleading, and that Debbie’s agents had been rather OTT and selective when using information to support the application.
The objectors made their feeling known very loudly and this obviously upset the Andrews and they responded defensively. Debbie accepts that Turbines are a contentious issue and that they polarise communities and cause divisions – well here was a perfect example of that effect.
Currently, many of us are lobbying government on this issue, asking for a clear, fair, and sensible national policy.
Now, my own hobbyhorse is visibility. One of the contentious matters surrounded Debbie’s agent’s assertion that the turbines would not be visible beyond 2.5 kms. We don’t need to get all technical here – it’s very easy to perform your own experiments.
For example if you were to stand on the road at Lanteglos Highway and look towards Bodmin, you would see two wind turbines in the distance, the larger one is the massive (and illegal) Dingle tower, but concentrate on the smaller one which is clearly visible even though it is 15 kms away! Yes it’s about 20% bigger than those that Debbie proposed, but it is so clearly visible that one can tell that is they were half the size they would still be seen. As I write I can see a telegraph pole on the hillside 1.5 klms away – it’s only 200 mms in diameter. Do your own experiments; an OS map is a big help.
My point? Well I think that this illustrates one of the reasons why the objectors got so upset and vocal.
Regards to all
Turbines ARE a contentious issue – surely though grown adults ought to refrain from personal insults such as suggesting the Andrews knowingly misled on their application by encouraging their agents to be ‘OTT and selective’ ?
We all have our hobbyhorses – it doesn’t make it correct behaviour to descend to personal insults just because a personal passion is involved.
Wouldn’t it be more adult to have discussed this in as dispassionate manner as possible ? To explore other possibilities and come up with alternative solutions ?
We live in a world that has finite resources – that’s a fact – whether palatable or not to the individual. The Andrew’s proposed and denied turbine represents a shift in mind set to renewable resources. Yes, perhaps the view may have been spoiled…did the objectors shout so loudly when pylons were being erected, when house prices rose so steeply Cornish people were priced out or any number of actions that have reduced much of our countryside to a graveyard – did they welcome electricity on tap or the opportunity to buy their lovely home from profits on the back of the property boom ? I don’t begrudge anyone their piece of heaven. Though, really, to protest because it spoils the view is breathtaking…
The move to renewable resources is an urgent necessity, perhaps we won’t see the benefits, our children and their children will though. Does that not matter to the protesters ? Is the ‘I’m allright Jack’ mentality so entrenched in your community ?
regards
Karen
Quite clearly the author of the previous post does not either live in Cornwall or an AONB.
To say that the objectors concern was that their view would be spoilt is a gross misrepresentation of the truth.
Many of your points are valid but have nothing whatsoever to do with this application.
Please re-read my last comment as I think that you may be responding not to what I actually said.
Please actually read and digest the reasons for refusa,l and try to understand that the Cornish economy (and also Debbie and Andrew’s) is, and will be for the foreseeable future, dependant on tourism-which is very much dependant on unspoiled landscape.
Agents being misleading and OTT….. We can debate this if you wish but I would prefer simply to ask you to agree that, their job is essentially to SPIN and that’s what they (all) do. Come on! They are just a rather more intelligent version of Estate Agents – always OTT and very often misleading.
Please support National pond Week – Google for more info.
What a wonderful example has been set by your neighbours.A planning application for a solar farm, green electricity, barely visible at 4 metres in height and a real gesture of being part of and caring for the community, preserving the landscape and AONB.
Why not follow suit ??????
Actually, I do live in Cornwall, for nearly two decades now so still quite a newcomer, and have had the pleasure of living on and stewarding an SSSI and working on farms, Mr Jones. So I am quite familiar with the intrigues of village life.
Mr Campbell-Taylor – you did actually state in your post that your hobby-horse was visibility. I’m sure you’ll correct my understanding of the English language if I’m wrong, visibility implies one could see the turbine from certain points and therefore impeded ones’ view. And I would prefer if your patronising attitude was left out of these posts, I’m well aware Cornwall has become dependent on tourism with very little agricultural work left. Believe it or not educated people actually live in the rather less AONB areas of Cornwall also, that’d be school and life educated.
As to ‘spin’ – one only has to read your posts to find a fine example.